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Smart meters

Is it possible to get a smart meter for my house to see the amount of gas and electric used ?

Comments

  • NeilG said:

    Is it possible to get a smart meter for my house to see the amount of gas and electric used ?

    Yes. Although you don't need a smart meter for that, your existing meters tell you how much gas and electric is used. Just not in quite so convenient a format.

    Bulb are rolling out smart meters now but you might not get yours for some time. See: https://help.bulb.co.uk/hc/en-us/articles/115001232872-When-will-Bulb-roll-out-smart-meters-
  • I've just had an email regarding the fitting of a smart meter. I do not want one. Should I let anyone know now or just keep ignoring the emails?
  • I've just had an email regarding the fitting of a smart meter. I do not want one. Should I let anyone know now or just keep ignoring the emails?

    I'm going to keep ignoring them. They need your consent to install them and the smart tariff will end up costing me more than the flat rate tariff as in my household we work full time and peak time is when we use our electricity.
  • the smart tariff will end up costing me more than the flat rate tariff as in my household we work full time and peak time is when we use our electricity.

    You don't have to go on the smart tariff just because a smart meter has been installed. The default is to stay on the single rate vari-fair tariff unless you request otherwise. There's simply no reason not to have a smart meter installed.
  • There is a good reason...They don't save you any money...and they are installed for the convenience of the energy companies


    You don't have to go on the smart tariff just because a smart meter has been installed. The default is to stay on the single rate vari-fair tariff unless you request otherwise. There's simply no reason not to have a smart meter installed.
  • There is a good reason...They don't save you any money...


    Mine is saving me money.
  • There is a good reason...They don't save you any money...and they are installed for the convenience of the energy companies


    You don't have to go on the smart tariff just because a smart meter has been installed. The default is to stay on the single rate vari-fair tariff unless you request otherwise. There's simply no reason not to have a smart meter installed.


    I'm concerned about security. Smart meters contain a relay able to cut off your supply remotely. What's wrong with a standard meter? I read it every month and I use the same energy if I had a smart meter or not.

    For environmental purposes why should I scrap a perfectly good meter for one that is of exactly 0 benefit to me?
  • Hooloovoo said:



    Mine is saving me money.

    How does it save you money?
  • Allanr said:

    Hooloovoo said:



    Mine is saving me money.

    How does it save you money?
    Yep, the meter itself doesn't save you energy or money (in fact the ihd has to be powered on consumer side)

    All it does is highlight what in your home uses a lot of electricity. Anyone who knows anything about electrical devices works it out quickly.


  • Yep, the meter itself doesn't save you energy or money (in fact the ihd has to be powered on consumer side)

    All it does is highlight what in your home uses a lot of electricity. Anyone who knows anything about electrical devices works it out quickly.

    Yes I agree with you I was just wondering how it saves @Hooloovoo money.
  • Allanr said:



    Yep, the meter itself doesn't save you energy or money (in fact the ihd has to be powered on consumer side)

    All it does is highlight what in your home uses a lot of electricity. Anyone who knows anything about electrical devices works it out quickly.

    Yes I agree with you I was just wondering how it saves @Hooloovoo money.
    I think they've fallen for the advertising.

    I will not take a smart meter until I'm told to.
  • He may be on the smart tariff?

  • Allanr said:

    How does it save you money?

    As I'm sure you're aware from my posts on here, I'm on the 3-rate smart tariff. I've demonstrated on here recently how that is saving me money including cost comparisons with the same energy use against the single rate vari-fair and also standard Economy 7.

    I couldn't be on a 3-rate tariff without a smart meter. And even if I could, if I decided to change back to the single-rate tariff at some point it would typically require me to pay £120 to replace the meters. With a smart meter all the configuration is handled in software for free.

    I think they've fallen for the advertising.

    I'm a little offended by this. I would have hoped that I'd shown sufficient intelligence on here for it to be obvious I'm not taken in by any advertising.
  • Hooloovoo said:

    Allanr said:

    How does it save you money?

    As I'm sure you're aware from my posts on here, I'm on the 3-rate smart tariff. I've demonstrated on here recently how that is saving me money including cost comparisons with the same energy use against the single rate vari-fair and also standard Economy 7.

    I couldn't be on a 3-rate tariff without a smart meter. And even if I could, if I decided to change back to the single-rate tariff at some point it would typically require me to pay £120 to replace the meters. With a smart meter all the configuration is handled in software for free.

    I think they've fallen for the advertising.

    I'm a little offended by this. I would have hoped that I'd shown sufficient intelligence on here for it to be obvious I'm not taken in by any advertising.
    The three rate tariff will definitely cost me more money as most of my electricity usage is at peak times.

    But loads of people have fallen for the misleading advertising.

    The way you were mentioning saving money a lot of us jumped on the bandwagon of thinking it reduced your usage.
  • Hooloovoo said:



    As I'm sure you're aware from my posts on here, I'm on the 3-rate smart tariff. I've demonstrated on here recently how that is saving me money including cost comparisons with the same energy use against the single rate vari-fair and also standard Economy 7.

    I couldn't be on a 3-rate tariff without a smart meter. And even if I could, if I decided to change back to the single-rate tariff at some point it would typically require me to pay £120 to replace the meters. With a smart meter all the configuration is handled in software for free.

    Unfortunately your smart tariff situation is not something I took notice. For those who opt purely for vari-tariff I personally see no monetary advantage in having a smart meter over the non smart version. Although I religiously check my bills for accuracy and keep spreadsheets of my usage over a good number of years I can't bear the thought of meticulously checking my energy usage in real time to save a couple of pounds, although I do recognise the environmental aspects.

  • The three rate tariff will definitely cost me more money as most of my electricity usage is at peak times.

    But loads of people have fallen for the misleading advertising.

    The way you were mentioning saving money a lot of us jumped on the bandwagon of thinking it reduced your usage.

    I do understand, and to be honest I was being deliberately provocative with my unsubstantiated "mine saves me money" statement purely in response to the unsubstantiated "they don't save money" statement. Quite clearly simply changing the meter cannot save you money, any more than visiting a different petrol pump could somehow make your car engine any more efficient.

    But that doesn't make the standard "arguments" against smart meters any more correct.

    Security. Ok, so there is potential to turn off the supply remotely. This can't be used by your supplier without going through the same regulations as are required to turn off your supply at the substation, so there's no worry there. Could it be hacked and the whole country turned off? Maybe. But most unlikely. Perhaps I'm optimistic, something of which I'm never normally accused. If that did ever happen and it looked like power was not going to be restored for days or weeks, personally I'd just cut the seals on the meter and bridge it out. I'd deal with the consequences of theft of electricity later, although in a UK-wide incident I very much doubt any action would be taken except for maybe the cost of restoring the meter and resealing. In the grand scheme of things, this "threat" is simply nothing to worry about.

    Privacy. I can only hope that anyone citing privacy as an objection doesn't have a cell phone, or use the internet either home/pubic, or make any lookups on domain name servers, or carry around any devices in public with WiFi/Bluetooth still active, or ... there are so many richer seams of information than anything that could be provided by half-hourly analysis of energy usage. Way bigger fish to fry.

    It's true the marketing of smart meters has been disingenuous at best, plain wrong at worst. They wont necessarily save you money right now. By marketing it as an upfront consumer benefit as opposed to simply infrastructure upgrades the rollout has been completely botched by the government, but then no one expected otherwise. Upgrading the infrastructure is all about better monitoring and control of the grid, more flexible billing, and encouraging people to think about their usage and make changes where possible to achieve better and more efficient usage of generation capacity which does save money. This includes better integration of local generation and battery storage, and eventual new appliances that do not have time-critical operation and so can be automated for load control. But none of that can happen until first the infrastructure is in place.
  • Allanr said:

    I can't bear the thought of meticulously checking my energy usage in real time to save a couple of pounds

    Not entirely sure why you would have to do that. I don't. It's not like the tariff changes in real time every few seconds.
  • Hooloovoo said:


    The three rate tariff will definitely cost me more money as most of my electricity usage is at peak times.

    But loads of people have fallen for the misleading advertising.

    The way you were mentioning saving money a lot of us jumped on the bandwagon of thinking it reduced your usage.

    I do understand, and to be honest I was being deliberately provocative with my unsubstantiated "mine saves me money" statement purely in response to the unsubstantiated "they don't save money" statement. Quite clearly simply changing the meter cannot save you money, any more than visiting a different petrol pump could somehow make your car engine any more efficient.

    But that doesn't make the standard "arguments" against smart meters any more correct.

    Security. Ok, so there is potential to turn off the supply remotely. This can't be used by your supplier without going through the same regulations as are required to turn off your supply at the substation, so there's no worry there. Could it be hacked and the whole country turned off? Maybe. But most unlikely. Perhaps I'm optimistic, something of which I'm never normally accused. If that did ever happen and it looked like power was not going to be restored for days or weeks, personally I'd just cut the seals on the meter and bridge it out. I'd deal with the consequences of theft of electricity later, although in a UK-wide incident I very much doubt any action would be taken except for maybe the cost of restoring the meter and resealing. In the grand scheme of things, this "threat" is simply nothing to worry about.
    True, suppose I'm being paranoid, however could state sponsored hack attacks could be a thing. But the fact the capability is there worrys me enough, my meter doesn't have that functionality so someone has to go into my home to disconnect me or put me on a pre pay.

    And the 'strong encouragement' for people to go on meters worrys me. In these environmentally conscious times why should we scrap perfectly working meters for new ones.

    Smart meters and on the smart tariff won't reduce countrywide energy usage but may change the timing but its still energy used.
  • True, suppose I'm being paranoid, however could state sponsored hack attacks could be a thing.

    I think any attack at this level would have to be nation-state hackers. It's highly unlikely any script-kiddie is going to hack the DCC system.

    But the fact the capability is there worrys me enough, my meter doesn't have that functionality so someone has to go into my home to disconnect me or put me on a pre pay.

    When you're "cut off" it's generally done outside your home, so no one would have to enter your home anyway. In any case, if it did get to such a serious position the supplier would obtain a warrant to enter your home and either disconnect or fit a prepayment meter. Even if you had smart meter, before remote disconnection the supplier must have contacted you to discuss options for repaying your debt, eg through a repayment plan, and also have visited your home to assess your personal situation and whether this would affect you being disconnected, eg if you’re disabled or elderly. The practical upshot being that a remotely operated contactor in the meter makes no difference at all.

    And the 'strong encouragement' for people to go on meters worrys me. In these environmentally conscious times why should we scrap perfectly working meters for new ones.

    I agree it's a waste to replace perfectly functional meters. However that has to be balanced with the environmental benefit to greening-up the grid through better and more efficient usage of generational capacity. I don't know enough to comment on this one way or another, and I suspect many people making this argument don't either. In terms of "strong encouragement" I don't even see why the person responsible for the property even gets a choice. Suppliers clearly should not be implying that the change is mandatory when it's not. But the supplier owns the metering equipment and if they want to change it then it's up to them. In my world none of this would have been "sold" to the consumer. It would have simply been an industrial upgrade project.

    Smart meters and on the smart tariff won't reduce countrywide energy usage but may change the timing but its still energy used.

    Nothing will reduce usage. Usage is only going up. The aim is to help balance the grid and reduce the large swings in usage, and this will be very difficult without any demand notification path back to electrical installations.
  • Hi Can a smart meter be fitted if I have a nest smart thermostat?
  • edited March 6
    Anthony63 said:

    Hi Can a smart meter be fitted if I have a nest smart thermostat?

    Simple answer is yes :)
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