Smart Meters and standing charges

Hello,

I have a chameleon smet2 smart meter that was fitted by EDF prior to my switch to Bulb. Its the same SMET Bulb are fitting except it does not have the home wifi option.

Anyway, I have woken up today to find the SMET with the following:

Electric: £0.29 (0.65 kwh)
Gas: 0.00 (0.00 kwh)

My Electric unit rate is 14.2p p/kwh and standing charge is 0.20p a day

I assume the reading of £0.29 on the SMET includes the standing charge for electric, is that correct?

What happens with the gas standing charge as some days gas only shows a few pence at the end of the day so does that not get displayed via the smet?

If I get to 10pm and the SMET shows say £1.50 for gas and electric am I right in assuming the electric standing charge is included in that but the gas is not?

Sorry if this is confusing, I am just trying to figure out how it works.

Thanks in advance.

Not really answering your question, but just to clarify what you’re called a “SMET” is the “IHD”, In Home Display.

SMETS is “Smart Metering Equipment Technical Specification” and not a specific device.

Also you didn’t have a “Chameleon SMET2 smart meter” fitted. Chameleon is the manufacturer of the IHD, not the meters themselves. The actual smart meters will be made by someone else, you can find out by looking for the manufacturer and model number printed on the devices that are connected to your incoming supply.

Not really answering your question, but just to clarify what you're called a "SMET" is the "IHD", In Home Display.

SMETS is “Smart Metering Equipment Technical Specification” and not a specific device.

Thank you for clarifying that for me. I assumed (Incorrectly) that SMET stood for Smart Meter haha.
I will know now for the future.
Thanks again.

In terms of your standing charges, on my old SMETS1 smart meter and IHD, it does include the standing charges and yes if I look at it at 10pm then than total includes everything. Well, it doesn’t really because Bulb haven’t updated the rates to match when I’m actually paying, but that’s a different issue.

With the SMETS2 meters that Bulb are installing, and I presume that same when they migrate a SMETS2 meter from another supplier, you’re right there is confusion regarding the standing charge. Anecdotally on here, some have said their display includes the standing charge, some have said it does not, and you’re right it also seems to vary between fuel type. That’s before you even get into missing data when it loses connection.

Basically I think no one really knows the answer to your question yet, least of all Bulb. Fun, eh?

@Hooloovoo Really fun! haha.

What I do know is that the IHD does show the unit rates and standing charge for both Gas and Electric in the Settings - Tariff section.

It does look like the standing charge is getting added to the Electric section total as £0.28p cannot be for 0.6kwh of electric.
At first I wondered if the standing charge for gas was added to the electric total seeing as the WAN meter box is attached to the Electric meter and the engineer told me the gas meter talks to the electric meter which is in control of the smart stuff.

However if that was the case I would expect to see 0.40p + when I wake up seeing as its 20p standing charge for each fuel.

From what I can see i am certain the electric charge is added to the live price figures but not the gas.

Its then even more unclear if the “Bill Period price” includes the gas standing charge either haha.

I have contacted bulb to ask for clarification, the lady said she had no idea so would ask the smart team. I do not expect a response as I am not sure anyone knows.



Here at the images of the IHD today.

My tariff is:

Electricity Unit Rate
14.31p per kWh
Electricity Standing Charge
20.44p per day

Gas Unit Rate
3.53p per kWh
Gas Standing Charge
20.44p per day

As you can see:

Electric:
Total: 0.43p
Total KWH: 1.60

14.31 x 1.60 = 22.896
22.896 + 20.44 = 43.336

So my total for today of 43p so far includes the electric standing charge.

If you then look at the gas image it shows 0.00

The total of both gas and electric is also 0.43p so the standing charge is not added there either.

Confusing!

Confusing!

All I can say is that the way you’ve described that you expect it to work, is I believe the way it’s supposed to work.

I can confirm at least that on my SMETS1 meter and IHD, the standing charge gets added a few seconds after midnight on the display. So yes, it says about 40p total (20p when viewing separate fuel) and then by morning has gone up a few tens of pence due to overnight background usage.

It makes sense when it works the way it’s supposed to. Yours just isn’t at the moment.

Confusing!

All I can say is that the way you’ve described that you expect it to work, is I believe the way it’s supposed to work.

I can confirm at least that on my SMETS1 meter and IHD, the standing charge gets added a few seconds after midnight on the display. So yes, it says about 40p total (20p when viewing separate fuel) and then by morning has gone up a few tens of pence due to overnight background usage.

It makes sense when it works the way it’s supposed to. Yours just isn’t at the moment.

Thanks for the help and input. This is not a Bulb issue as it did the same when EDF installed it, it has just remained the same since switching to Bulb.

I am not really sure who would be the people to sort it out or if this is just how the IHD works from the manufacturer.

I suppose its just important to inform Bulb in the hopes that whoever can fix it is aware of it.

ok so I do not normally stay up this late but this has been bugging me and I needed to see what was happening.
I have found out what is going on.

Midnight:

Electricity resets to 0.00
Gas remains on previous days usage of 0.47p.

0:54 AM
Gas adds standing charge to the usage : 0.47p went to 0.67p
A few seconds later gas resets to 0.00p

0.55 AM
Gas + Electric combined now show 0.01p

1.00 AM
20p standing charge is added to electric taking the electric to 0.22p, gas at 0.00p

Conclusion:

Standing charge for electric is added at 1AM so you get to see that reflected in the IHD all day.
Standing charge for gas is not added until 0.54 AM, a few seconds before that daily gas price is removed and classed as yesterday before resetting to 0.00p

I am not sure if there is any way for Bulb to set the IHU to add the Gas standing charge at 1AM like electric after the usage for the day has been reset, therefore having both standing charges showing on the IHU in the morning and allowing me to see the actual price of the usage throughout the day instead of me having to add 20p to whatever I see on the IHU.

@Hooloovoo

Is there any way for me to raise a support ticket for this or to tag someone who could look at it?
Bulbs helpdesk has no idea and they said the smart team is dealing with thousands of issues from installs so will not be able to look at it for a while.

Ok so here is where we start having issues and bad communication.

The Charmelion IHU 100% does display standing charges as can be seen from the calculations above.

Bulb then email me to say

If your In Home Display is a Chameleon like ours, it won't record the daily standing charge on the daily usage for either gas or electricity, so this probably just means you're using slightly more electricity at night time.

Your account has been successfully switching onto the half hourly readings.

All the best,

Nicola

This is incorrect and is not great as a customer to be told something that I can see with my eyes as being wrong.

Any suggestions on what I can do to get this issue escalated?

Also if anyone has had the Chameleon IHU installed by Bulb, they look like this:

Can you please let me know how your IHU acts.

Does it add the standing charges to the usage?

Thanks

Is there any way for me to raise a support ticket for this or to tag someone who could look at it? Bulbs helpdesk has no idea and they said the smart team is dealing with thousands of issues from installs so will not be able to look at it for a while.

Unfortunately Bulb’s helpdesk is how you raise a support ticket.

Is there any way for me to raise a support ticket for this or to tag someone who could look at it? Bulbs helpdesk has no idea and they said the smart team is dealing with thousands of issues from installs so will not be able to look at it for a while.

Unfortunately Bulb’s helpdesk is how you raise a support ticket.

Thank you, do you know if any of the smart team are active on the forum and tagable?

I have seen some bulb staff get tagged but unsure of their role or if they could help.

Thank you for all the help.

Thank you, do you know if any of the smart team are active on the forum and tagable?

The only one I know of is @“Selina at Bulb” but she doesn’t seem to visit the community any more.

She was active in the other thread you’re posting on back around November last year.

Thank you, do you know if any of the smart team are active on the forum and tagable?

The only one I know of is @“Selina at Bulb” but she doesn’t seem to visit the community any more.

She was active in the other thread you’re posting on back around November last year.

Hmm Interesting. Maybe @“Eleanor at Bulb” or @“William at Bulb” could point to who I contact regarding this.

Maybe @“Daniel at Bulb” is Dan Cullum head of the smart team, but he has not visited since Feb either :frowning:

Thanks for all the help @Hooloovoo

I can also confirm that the charmelion IHD (Which is the same as the ones bulb supplies I believe) do show the standing charges added overnight to the usage cost.

I have the IHD6, fitted by Bulb’s contractor, which is a wholly touch screen device with no buttons along the bottom. I am fairly sure the standing charge is not added in to the daily usage figures as with the gas boiler off the daily usage is £0.00. On the fitting, day 15th August this year, there was a gas charge shown at £0.08 just as the engineer tested it. As far as electricity is concerned I am not sure, If it is added then it must be at some odd time and not near midnight. I haven’t waited up to check through the night. What I do know is that the IHD is switching electric tariff between cheap rate and full rate as though the time was GMT whereas the meter outside is switching correctly using BST. The time displayed on the IHD is showing BST (without the caption of course). I will be interested to see what happens as the clocks change!

I can attach a photo of the IHD6 if someone points me to the method to add photos.